About three months ago I got a nice shiny new version of GOTY.

Ever since then though, I have been encountering this seemingly inexplicable issue: Every time my save games approach 2:12:30 in duration, Oblivion crashes.
I have tried repeated (total) reinstalls, and have tested both with and without mods.
I also know its not an issue with the save game duration, because I can load older (>300 hour) save games with no issues (although I have not tried playing these for 2:12:30 to see if they crash after that).
It is not the animation bug either (no slow down, just an abrupt crash), although I have tried fixing the savegames for that.

I cannot seem to find anything similar to this on the internet.
I have encountered this issue with several different characters.

Does anyone know anything about this?
Would anyone be willing load a copy of one of my savegames to see if the issues in the savegame or on the system?

Thank you. Please comment if you can think of even the slightest possibility.

One thing that occurs to me, is the possibility that you have a background program that runs on a timed schedule, could be something like any of the following:

Realplayer
Google updater
your virus protection updater
Itunes updater
an instant message program
your windows updater
adobe acrobat updater


etc like that.

Any programs running in the background that "call" a function, especially an internet function, could result in a CTD, actually.

I agree with myrmaad.my security software would crash my game everytime it updated,I complained to the makers of said software,and to my surprize got an update that added a button for me to bypass the security program when playing a game,it lasts for a few hours and then enables itself again.

I appreciate the thought - but its not that.

What happens is that once my save game gets up to 2:12:30 in game time, it causes the game to crash. I can leave Oblivion running almost infinitely if I don't have a save game loaded. If I do have one loaded though, the time until crash will be given by
(2:12:30 - Time I have played the save game = time until crash)

So if I have a savegame with 2:11:30, I have one minute of time after I load the game.

hmmm. That's an oddity isn't it? I can't think of anything that might cause that, offhand, but if I come across anything I'll find this thread again. That's very strange, and if I understand you correctly, that means you have to start a new game after that?

If so, it warrants a call to Bethesda Technical Support, they may have seen it before.

Ok, I don't know if it'll help, but I suspect it might.

Wrye Bash is a very valuable utility for mods. It can look daunting and complex, but once you figure it out, it's invaluable.

It has features for save games(among a ton of other uses) that removes save game bloat, repair abomb, repair factions and repair hair. Even if you don't use mods, this can help with those save games. I suspect either bloat or abomb is your problem. With Wrye Bash's feature of this, you can repair them in seconds.

Wrye Bash requires these 2 programs to run. install them and then install Wrye Bash:
http://www.python.org/download/releases/2.5/

http://sourceforge.net/project/downloading...se_mirror=voxel

Then Download Wrye Bash 212:
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/User:Wrye

Yes. I've been "reborn" I forget how many times in the last two or three months.
I sent off an email to tech support - even though I'm using Vista, maybe they will give me a hand.



I've tried that - all of the options available, even if I thought they had no relation to the issue.
I at first thought similar to what you had (that it was bloat or anbomb), but after repeatedly having the same issue at the exact same time with different savegames, and trying Wrye Bash (and another anbomb utility), I don't see how it can be.

Ok, this is a long shot, a mere guess, more gut feeling than anything else. Recently tested your RAM? Preferably by running a memtest from a live-cd?

Hi Ethre, if your saved game doesn't include a myriad mods which I don't have loaded. I'll run one for you. I seem to recall you offered me similar assistance, PM or Mail me

Good suggestion - may be a long shot, but long shots are the only shots I seem to have here. I haven't tested the RAM on my laptop like I used to when I was running a desktop, so thanks for bringing it to my mind. I wouldn't do it any other way than a Memtest 86+ CD.



Update: It seems they don't bother to read Vista support messages:

Not even a mention of whether they had, or had not, heard of a similar issue before.
Well, I'll give them a call tommorrow and see if I can get more info over the phone.



I appreciate it. I'll send you a PM in just a moment.

Put off telling them which platform you have by launching write into the timing issue and asking point blank if they've ever heard of anything similar reported before. Just beat around the bush on your platform by engaging the techie for a bit. As soon as you say Vista he's off the hook you know, so try not to say it for as long as possible, because your conversation will be over at that point.

I like the idea of someone running your savegame on an XP test system. That would put teeth into your Tech Support call.

From your previous info, you are running on a laptop. That might make a difference, Not sure just how yet. Also, this only happens on a saved game, not an unsaved game.

So we need to figure out what playing a saved game does at precisely 2:12:30 that an unsaved game doesn't. That precise time leads away from a hardware problem - Unless it is something peculiar to your laptop and Oblivion.

Is that 2:12:30 game time or real time?

What happens if you stop doing anything and let the time pass at that point? Does the problem happen, or does it wait until you start playing again?

In your first post you say you got a new version, Does that mean you have an older version? If so, Could you uninstall the GOTY version completely, rename the existing Bethesda Softworks directory (to get rid of any old bits and pieces without deleting anything you might want to put back later) Rename the Oblivion folder in your documents and settings folder (same reason) then run a registry cleaner to clean out the remnants of Oblivion from the registry. Be sure to reboot Both before and after using the registry cleaner - I recommend free CCleaner - available here: http://www.majorgeeks.com/download4191.html

Then, Defrag before reinstalling the old version, or if you feel lucky the new GOTY version and try it before any patches or mods.

If you need help on a full removal, let me know, I have a help file for that.

This is a very strange problem. Let us know what happens and what you do to fix it.

Received: Just mail it over as an attachment then

Good news: After talking to tech support, he mentioned that it sounded like a corrupt registry entry and that he could give me instructions on a complete uninstall. I figured it couldn't hurt to see what Bethesda had to say, so when he sent them I took a look at their process. It was basically the exact same as a standard removal/reinstall (which I had already done, a couple times) - with the exception that they included a section on removing the InstallShield Installation Information. Since I'd never removed that before, I gave it a go.

It seems to have worked - I can now play past the 2:12:30 block!
I'm not certain why this worked, although I have the suspicion that some of the files in the installshield folder may have been corrupted in my first install. I don't think the installer is supposed to use these files in the original install (they are usually for direct reinstalls), but this may have happened - it would explain why earlier reinstalls did nothing to help.

Hopefully this has fixed the issue, because I still have a bit of a gut worry that in another 2 hours of play time I will encounter a similar issue.

Thank you to all who read this thread, and especially to those who offered thoughts/advice. I appreciate this greatly.



I did my best, and while he didn't answer my question about this occurring before, it does seem to have worked out.



As mentioned above, I think this has worked out *cross my fingers*, but I'm still not certain exactly why.
So in response to your questions:


That would be very odd, although it might be possible.
I have never had a game that I didn't save in 2 hours. The issue does not come up when only the main menu is loaded though (no game loaded).
If the issue arises again, I will try and see if I can manage 2 hours without a save.


I wondered for a while if there was something peculiar about the time. I don't know enough about how Oblivion records the time to be able to check the binary/hex numbers for oddities though.


Real time. game time varied between my different characters.


If I am not playing, but its not yet in idle, then it crashes. I am not certain what happens if it is in idle though - would have been interesting to check.


Unfortunately, no. That's one of the reason's I got GOTY - my original disc died. RIP.
CCleaner's a good program. Good recommendation there. I used to use it on my desktop, thank you for bringing it back to my mind as I hadn't been using it on my laptop. I had deleted to registry keys for Oblivion (there's one main one, and one uninstall one) manually previously.

*Special thanks to pedantic for his offer.

Further information: In case anyone is wondering, here are Bethesda's complete uninstall/reinstall instructions:

Wish they'd put that information into a sticky post. That would surely help others out. BTW, Congrats on your problem being fixed.

I agree, Bben has a work in progress which he'll most likely incorporate this into, once he spots it.

I've already seen it. It's very close to mine. Either way will work.

Mine will allow you to keep any saves and mods plus your customized ini file. And I give you the option of making a back up clean save along with it.

Instead of having you edit the Windows registry, Which is dangerous if you don't know what you are doing. If you were to overwrite or delete the registry it will make your computer unable to boot.

I recommend using a registry cleaning program such as ccleaner. It's free, reliable and available here http://majorgeeks.com/download4191.html.

If used after uninstalling and either deleting or renaming the Oblivion folder it will clean out the oblivion references in the registry. Be sure to reboot your computer both before and after you use it to be sure it gets them all. At the same time it will clean out any other unused references and quite a bit of other junk from the registry. Then before reinstalling be sure to defrag.

Been there, done that (or very close to it), learned not to do it again.

I'm a registry hack from waaay back, but nope I've never done that. I used to be pretty sharp. I'm getting old.

I was 14(?) and it was my first time really playing with Windows. I didn't know much about the registry, and was looking around in it trying to figure out what it did. I don't remember exactly what I did, but I think I was messing with some of the explorer entries. Suffice to say, one of my edits made booting the machine a bit difficult.

But I learned pretty quickly what not to do. Since then, I've been real careful with entries that I don't know about.

I do find that registry cleaners miss a good deal though, and so I manually go through every once in a while.

There is a lot you can do by manually editing the registry. But first rule is to make a backup first. NO exceptions. I have used several other registry cleaners and found ccleaner to not only do a better job, but to err on the side of safety while getting rid of MOST junk entries. It's also the fastest cleaner I have tried. It can be set to clean out other things besides the registry too.

I think my saved game has the same problem as well. mine crashes at around 4:54 game time. though strange thing is, only my main saved game crashes. If I start a new game it doesn't crash .

Can you tell me the exact steps I need to take to fix this? Preferably without having to uninstall everything, since it would take me literally hours to reinstall the game along with the mods.

It sounds like you are crashing at around 5 hours. The Original post was precisely 2:12:30. If you are crashing at exactly the same time every time, you may have the same problem. And Bethesda recommended a completer uninstall and reinstall to clear up a corrupted registry entry.

However, if your crash is not at exactly the same time every time, your problem may be different. Crashes are a part of Oblivion. 5 hours is a decent time to play without a crash. My first suggestion is after about 2 hours, take a break. Make a new save. Exit Oblivion. Turn off the computer to give it a rest.

Do something different for a short time. Get something to eat, take a walk, Talk to your significant other, check your email.
Then go back and restart, load your save and play for another two hours. - repeat above.

Then go back and play again. watch the time If you play for over 2 hours, then your problem is different. If it crashes after about an hour then it MIGHT be the same problem.

If it is the same problem, then you will have to go through the complete uninstall, including removing the registry entries, either manually as in the Bethesda recommendation, or using a registry cleaning program as I recommend.

If you find a fix, especially one that does not involve uninstalling, please let us know.

Here is my recommended uninstall reinstall procedure that leaves you with a clean install plus a backup clean install so you don't have to do it again, and saves all of your saved games and mods so you can put them back in or not as you want.

This, along with other help files is available at my site, The Storm Raven Library
http://s1.zetaboards.com/TheStormRavenLibrary/index/



When you uninstall Oblivion it doesn't really uninstall everything.

It does not remove your mods, save games or Oblivion.ini. It also does not remove helper programs such as OBSE, OBMM, Wrye Bash, The construction set or any other programs you have installed in the \Oblivion folder or the save game folder. I recommend that you go ahead and delete them, then re download and install the latest version of them again later. After you have verified that the game works.

Then when you start adding mods before you have started the game, some things may not get initialized properly. Here is my recommended procedure for uninstalling and reinstalling.

I would appreciate any feedback on this as it is something I expect to post often and I hate to give bogus or useless information.

Uninstalling Oblivion

My instructions assume you are using Windows XP and have installed Oblivion into the default location. If you are using Vista or Linux, the file locations may be different, however, the procedure will be the same.

For a full reinstall, first you can try to preserve your mods and save games. I recommend that you save them in a new folder with a new name. Create the new folder in C:\Program files\Bethesda Softewrks. Name it Old Files. So it will be C:\Program Files\Bethesda softworks\Old files.

Then copy the data folder where your mods are to the new folder - do not erase them, copy them. And in the new folder, rename the \data folder to \olddata. Then copy and rename the folder that has your saved games and Oblivion.ini, C:\documents and settings\your user name\my documents\My Games\oblivion to something like \My games\Old Oblivion - this saves your saved games and the oblivion.ini file.

Then, using the original CD, NOT the Launcher on your Hard drive. Select uninstall.

After it completes the uninstall, reboot your computer - this is important as it allows Windows to remove some references to the original Oblivion.

This would be the time to erase all of the helper programs you have in the \Oblivion folder. Such as OBMM, OBSE and some others. The simplest way is to erase the folder completely. The new install will re create the folder for you along with a fresh oblivion.ini and when you start the game and make a save, a new save folder and new \data folder.

This would also be a good time to do a file clean up and defragment your hard drive.

If you are worried about the registry entries that were left behind. There are several good programs for removing left behind entries. The one I use is ccleaner. Be sure to reboot before using it, and again after. It is available here: http://majorgeeks.com/download4191.html


Now to Reinstall.

Again using the original CD, install Oblivion.

Special instructions for Vista only: Do not install to the default location - make a new folder such as C:\Games and install there. That way you will not be bothered by the problems caused by the Vista UAC security not allowing mods to work.

Before adding any mods, patches, helper programs, Shivering Isles or anything else, start the game and make a save. This initializes some stuff that needs to be initialized.

If you are using the Game of the Year version of Oblivion you should not need any patches, skip the patching part.

Now, If you DO NOT use Shivering Isles, patch the game using ONLY the latest Oblivion patch. All of the stuff from the earlier patches is included.

Be sure you use the proper language patch. If you use the wrong one it may work, but with a strange mixture of languages. (Germanglish?) Or it may crash.

NOTE: there are two English Patches UK & US and they are different. (Some people actually think we speak the same language) Use the one that matches your original disk.

If you use Shivering Isles, Install it now. DO NOT install the Oblivion patch. Install Shivering Isles, then ONLY the latest Shivering Isles patch. All of the updates for Oblivion are included. There is only one Shivering Isles patch for both US & UK English

Now, again start the game and make a save. Test to be sure everything is working right (No purple objects or yellow blocks)

Before adding any mods, back up both your \data folder and the save game folder. Copy them, don't move or rename them, to a different folder - such as \Bethesda\Clean Oblivion\data and \Bethesda\clean Oblivion\saves. Note that this is a different folder than the one used for your old data and saves.

Note, Your Oblivion.ini file is in the same folder, but separate from, the save game folder.

Now, if you want to try to run with your old mods, first rename the original folders. The \data folder to \newdata and the \oldata back to \data. this restores all of your mods. You should now have 2 data folders \data, and \newdata in your \oblivion folder

To restore your original saves and ini file, rename the new My Games\Oblivion to something like \New Oblivion. and the \Old oblivion to \oblivion - this restores all of your saved games and your original Oblivion.ini file.

DO NOT erase the files you renamed. These are your backup files in case the original mods do not work or give you the same problem.

If you have the same problem, it is most likely caused by a mod. However, you now have a clean install to fall back on. You can rename the files back to what they were and be back to your clean install without having to reinstall again.

Sounds like lots of work, but you will have a clean install and a back up clean install when you are finished.

Post your comments here: http://s1.zetaboards.com/TheStormRavenLibrary/forum/236320/

Actually, by 4:54, I meant the game clock, not play time. And unfortunately, I saved about 1 second before that time, so my game crashes almost immediately when I start the saved game. If I start the same save from a backup saved file, it still crashes at around that time.

Double post x.x