So, DO you love OBSE, please explain.

i 100% hate it most mods request it true but i only use it if i really really really like the look of a mod but untill then its a no for now

Carth Onasi

How could anybody hate something that is not only optional but adds elements to the game which would otherwise be impossible?

If you don't care to use it then don't but waste such a strong emotion on it? Crazy!

Cheers.

quite easy

Carth Onasi

For me, it's mandatory. I love it. I can understand not understanding how to use it or what it does, but I'd really like to hear a rational explanation of why anyone would "hate" it.

for me its 50/50, I find it hard to "love" a program, or to "hate it. It is what it is,nothing more,nor nothing less

Yes, I like OBSE since it extends the script capacity beyond the original instruction set of the engine.

Are it's detractors really aware why they "hate" it? Think you a mod that uses OBSE uses only OBSE functions?

OBSE isn't meant to correct vanilla instructions, OBSE should not be seen as another mod... once installed it "integrates" with the engine, it is just a larger engine with enhanced functions.

When Beth did Oblivion it used a small bit of an extensive array of OpCodes, reserved a second range for future expansions (like SI indeed used a few more of those addresses) and liberated all remained to 3th part use.

One will blame OBSE because it can't be used by D2D versions but the use of encrypted code is the real culprit, not even by technological restrictions but legal ones.

Can't use OBSE because you prefer former versions? OK, I don't know your motivations but you have the rights to them, so OBSE isn't for you. Just remember if you can't use a mod because it depends on OBSE... "KNOW" that mod most of times couldn't be done other way, or would be impractical to be done without it.

Several will say OBSE is to blame for problems that clearly aren't from it. If a mod that uses OBSE functions fails someway this isn't reason enough to blame OBSE as failed itself. Would be the same that blame the engine for all no "OBSE mods" that fails (or how is more common, user fails).

I'm not advocating OBSE as flawless, I know for self experience no system or software is perfect. No system like OBSE (or the own oblivion CS) can foresee what will be done with it's resources. But if not structurally wrong all mods can have their's bugs fixed.

What seems impossible to fix is the mentality of some users. Eagers to find "brujas" and burns them out.

Wait a minute... No guys, tyreil is right! If my research here is correct, OBSE could be one of the biggest thrats to humanity ever devised! Take a look at this excerpt from OBSE's main website:

I think the excerpt speaks for itself. Now, if you'll excuse me, I have some hideous porno to be disgusted by. Good day, gentlemen.

Oh yes, and communists eat children, the pope is pop and the Venusian Incas will conquer earth. Of course

Edit: Just a warning, maybe I'm wrong while I think the rules of demeaning any "mod" without presenting pertinent reasons doesn't applies to the forum like in the files comments, but I think no.

If you're going to make such outrageous claims, I'm going to have to ask you to back them up with hard (potentially fake) links to websites that may or may not exist saying that. Obviously, the Mayans will destroy the world in four years.

At least he took it out of his sig...

Indeed! Just making ludicrous claims like that, no evidence, no excerpts... It gives serious researches like me a bad name!

Anyway, I actually think that OBSE is absolutely (Or should I say OBSElutely? HA HA HA I AM CLEVER) necessary for any serious Oblivion player. Not just that, I can't for the life of me think of a single reason to outright hate it, you know? I mean, it only does... good things? It just doesn't make sense. And coming from me, that says a lot.

I don't know what the whole todo is about. The first mod I ever installed used OBSE and I've had it installed the whole time. It's an expansion of the game engine. I have seen nothing as far as decrease in performance in my game. and every mod works fine except for one and that's my fault.

The biggest difference I can tell when using OBSE and not using OBSE is whether or not my demon can fly. Removing it only removes functionallity. Adding it means... well what benifit is there to not having it?

OBSE/CraftyBits tended to crash firefable's game, and he's been sort of bitter about it ever since.

I get a kick out of the poll being designed so that voters can choose either to hate OBSE, or not use it.

OBSE. I will never play Oblivion without it. It's just so darn good. Plus it's constantly being updated.

The only problem I see is: polls like this one are about an application existent in the nexus, an application aways evolving to give modders resources to do things not possible before.

We aren't talking about one more place to relieve frustration. The results of this poll may have influence in newbies and even in some veterans. What is said about the mod here can be damaging to it. Demeaning can't be allowed without support from hard evidences.

A little bit of honesty never hurts. At first I didn't like OBSE because I couldn't get it to work right. Then I found out that the levelling mod I was using was outdated, and the mod author recommended to install Elys Uncapper in place of his mod.

To make a long story short, Elys required OBSE. So I had to learn the right way to use it. I dug into the readme, followed the directions, and it's been smooth sailing ever since.

So OBSE is OK. I got a better levelling mod now that I'm using it.

Nosisab, this is why I complained about the last poll / thread about OBSE. I felt it was a needless slam against the developers of something you CHOOSE to use.

In that one though, I got smacked down, being told it was not a slam on them. I still don't see the point of these polls and agree that it can influence a newcomer.

*shrug*

ok yes, i admit, i'm kinda edgy about using OBSE, especially when i lost my data file. but thats not the point, since 78.57% of you like OBSE so much, tell me, how do i install it properly? and Y is crashing my game? doesn't seem to be happening to all of you. I have the latest patch, SI and Knights all installed on my PC, is there an error among them and OBSE?


to: Varus Torvyn - sorry mate, about that topic that i made before, about OBSE, i was angry and really wanted to stab somebody.

Im willing OBSE another try, but this time i will backup my WHOLE oblivion folder, even thou its about 20gig.

Yes I do.

I'm using OBSE for a good amount of time in principal for the Streamline and other good mods that require it and I'm really happy with it, in fact I cannot play without it.

Of course I like it! Without it half of the really interesting mods for this game wouldnt exist. And if I have to endure some random crashes (okay a lot of random crashes) to play these mods so be it.

I don't think you need to back up your whole Oblivion folder just to try OBSE. Of course, it's a good idea to always back up your most important ones like save games, etc.

As for installation the read me instructions are very clear: copy obse_1_1.dll, obse_1_2.dll, obse_1_2_416.dll, obse_editor_1_0.dll, obse_editor_1_2.dll, and obse_loader.exe into your Oblivion directory.
Launch Oblivion from obse_loader.exe, you can make a short cut to desktop or your choosing location.
Also, if you have installed OBMM, open it, click the setting tab on the right and in the new window, make sure under Oblivion command line you have obse_loader. If it's not there right click obse_loader.exe and copy the path into the command line.

ok, thanks, ill try it, but i still will back up my oblivion folder, my data folder got "lost" once already and i dont want it to happen again, it took ages to find and reinstall all the mods i had.

50/50. Crashes my game a lot but get's me playing some good mods.

First off, I downloaded the latest version. It did irritate me that it installed into a separate folder, unlike Wrye Bash, which installs perfectly.

I noted that I had to make a \Data\OBSE\Plugins folder to place the mods (.dll files) into that required OBSE.

I opened up the Readme file within Notepad, printed it out, and followed these directions:

[ Installation ]

1. Copy obse_1_1.dll, obse_1_2.dll, obse_1_2_416.dll, obse_editor_1_0.dll, obse_editor_1_2.dll, and obse_loader.exe to your Oblivion directory. This is usually in your Program Files folder, and should contain files called "Oblivion.exe" and "OblivionLauncher.exe".
2. Run oblivion by running obse_loader.exe from the Oblivion directory.

If you use a desktop shortcut to launch Oblivion normally, just update the shortcut to point to obse_loader.exe instead of oblivion.exe.

About that last sentence, you can also use Wrye Bash to start Oblivion + OBSE (but I have auto-quit enabled so Wrye Bash exits after launch).

Edit - OBSE is needed only if you have mods that need it. The program is actually on a par with OBMM & Wrye Bash because it opens up Oblivion even more.

I could make the same argument for Random's FCOM Helper. It actually load-orders mods better than any other program. But you still need to open OBMM afterward for a few seconds, so the Oblivion hidden file "Plugins.txt" will be updated with the latest load-order.

i will never get along with OBSE for a long time i bet

Carth Onasi

Firefable, there's an answer for you two posts back.

Maybe I can explain why I say OBSE is blamed most of times for wrong reasons. OBSE is just a collection of instructions, they are simple functions, most of times, that fetches some status, variable or reference and returns a value. Such thing is easy to track a bug.

Although OBSE is itself a wonderful masterpiece of simplicity it lacks (purposefully) any connections between it's functions. Each one is kept isolate and perform over a single target (or a few, like the vanilla instructions does too). It perform a single command and returns a single value with very small chances of an error.

But this isn't true to the mod itself. Mod scripts are complex animals that relies it's logic is flawless, the interactions becomes the script soul. exactly like vanilla functions the OBSE ones will do what it does, exactly like vanilla if the mod logic fails this is beyond the scope of the engine and becomes the script responsibility.

So, unless is proved the function itself failed, OBSE is no more to blame for an error than the original game engine itself. And even when such occurs, in OBSE or the mod, Isn't reason to shun them. Bugs are a sadly reality in programming and the better is hunting them down and step by step correct the work to it's full glory.

Think about these words.

Edit: Don't think by the told that OBSE is a simple work, it demands a high degree of skills in low level programming and deep understanding of the machine structure. But the application itself is blessed by the need to verify only isolated functions with little or no concern with the "how" it will be used.

of course i like OBSE...

the game would be less fun withot the ability cut people in half?? or duplicate an item??

ok, i followed the instructions, i also heard that an error exists when you use SI and OBSE, so i got rid of SI, installed OBSE and just used 1 mod that requires it (Deadly Reflex), and guess what, i had only 1 crash within about 2 hours of playtime. I must admit, i was wrong, i spent those two hours cutting people's throats and i LOVED IT! OBSE is not that bad after all. thanks everybody

Edit: Now then, does anyone want to advise an OBSE mod?

this-
http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=18903

btw i am using both OBSE and SI and i rarely CTD

This is a very good description from a technical standpoint!

I hope more people will read this before blame OBSE for constant "Crashing to Desktop"!

That's great that you got it working!

Now I was just thinking that those who hate OBSE must run screaming from the room at COBL!!

you have no idea love

Carth Onasi

LOL

I love OBSE most of my favorite mods wouldn't work without it. Out of all the mods I have there are 2 I couldn't play the game without OBMM and OBSE.

That's exactly why "love" is not too strong a word to describe my feeling for OBSE. I'd have to quit playing and go back to the Wii.

that is why everyone is sceaming mad you love it 2 much!

Carth Onasi

If it wasn't for OBSE I'd have gotten bored of Oblivion long ago. Possible at the 100 hours point but according to Xfire I have 300+ hours logged into Oblivion.

You only need copy the editor files if you plan on modding and you certainly don't have to load Oblivion via OBMM just to use OBMM's functions by the way.

Don't know about this OBSE + SI error. Doesn't manifest itself on my game. SI runs as smooth as silk for me.

I'm running only one OBSE mod, Elys Uncapper. Running 61 other mods - Omods included - and starting the game with OBSE doesn't affect any of my game.

But then again, it's probably because I'm completely patched (including Unofficial Patches), and I used FCOM Helper to load-order.

Oblivion doesn't like to run under Vista on my computer, which is why I'm glad I use a dual-boot setup, and can run it under XP.

OBSE works fine for me, haven't had any CTD issues yet, but like Varus, I keep everything fully patched.
Also, I use TES4Gecko extensively to merge multiple mods into single ones... the fewer mods the program needs to keep track of, the better... (of course, it takes a while to merge mods correctly, but it's great once finished).

That's odd, mate. Oblivion runs superbly for me under Vista 32 or 64. You might want to check drivers.

Something weird with my using a Sony VAIO, Vista Business (not the Sony bundled version... that one was full of bloatware), and GOTY... when I tried to install under Vista, it wouldn"t recognize that the disk was in the drive. Works fine under XP, though, and since XP uses less processor and RAM... it's win/win for me.

I can't say I love it, though I did tick that for its the closet one that applied.. I wouldn't do without it for it adds the ability like having one of my favourite complex companions Rhianna, and other things. Like being able to lie down on a bed at last instead of just staring at it, with watch yourself sleep mod, it adds realism mods..like actors in charfge to sit down and actually drink from a mug, or eat..ect..

.I cannot blame it for those CTD moments..I have played Oblivion so many times, for sooooo long.. with and without it, and face the facts..Oblivion will CTD on occasion ... ..tis the nature of the beast..Its why I have DL auto save every 5 minutes, its saved me arse allot..

But to blame OBSE for crashes...its more apt to be mod conflicts, or load order, that when you start gathering allot its becomes a small annoyance, and a big one for those who do not save often before a big scenario, or DL something will auto save ones game, use OBM, to try some diffrent things and see if it helps... suss things out at bit..
But OBSE for me has made my game better and if it crashes now and then, eh its always done that, what helps is keeping everything updated UOP..and all..

Anything that improves upon gameplay is a plus in my book. OBSE has worked out perfectly fine for me on my Vista 64-bit box. I'm running probably well over 100+ mods and maybe a dozen using OBSE?

I agree 100% on this basic truth of script responsibility. From my own experience in writing scripts, I found as an amateur that some scripts I had written functioned in desired effects that wasn't true to script formats. Through errors in my scripts I attained desired effects but after grasping more understanding on function parameter formats, I discovered my bugs. This was through OBSE. At first I was intimidated with it in the beginning, but now it's like comparing C++ to basic. ^^ well maybe not so extreme. But Yes! OBSE all the way. The better it improves the enhancement of Oblivion, then I'm for it.

Aoikani