the answer is yes.. the great modder jannix quinn has stopped modding.. for reason only known to him..

if you dont know jannix.. i can tell you that the was a modder who made what he liked.. action figures and funny T-shirt:D hehe

just post a message to him .. it would be appiciated..


-i learned a few days ago that giskard has left us too,, AND WITH GOOD REASON I THNK, (not that Jannix didnt have a good reason)

I dont wanna see any flammers here!!

Just DL'd one saturday,this is news to me!

me to..

He's probably just updating something...

I think Jannix realised he might have crossed the copyright line with some of his releases and is currently fixing things up. At least thats what i was told, the source is not close to Jannix so it may be totally wrong.

Anyway im sure he would welcome a few words of encouragement either way, just in case its something more serious. I am sure jannix would not say no to a donation or two either. So drop by his website and wish him your best. It can only help.

http://www.rubyblade.com/tes/

Giskard

Yes he has quit.

i am sorry to hear your decision..
and i wanted to say that.. JQs assisin quest.. was one the best mods made..

you will be missed

Sorry to hear your decision.You alone know your reasons,and I shall respect your decision!
Atrue loss to us all!

I guess things never got any better Jannix ay ?

My world improved dramatically the moment i stopped using beths forums. Stopping public support for my mods and disabling comments and votes helps remove the idiots from my world too. But not using beths forums was the biggest single improvement to my modding world.

I would recommend it to you.

If you need a chat with a fellow modder about it, just pm me Jan.
Youve been a good person the whole time ive known you, id hate to leave you unsupported at a time like this.

All the best my friend.

Giskard

Whatever your reasons Jannix good luck for the future and thanks for all your mods. You gave us some of the best and most original mods released and we all owe you for enriching our Oblivion experience.

Sad day...I hope you'll reconsider. Your mods were like a breath of fresh air and will be missed. I loved the sense of humor and originality!

I tend to use lore friendly mods only but I have always made an exception for your mods...I was looking forward to add those Mannimarc-O's & al to my game

All the best!

I hope you will reconsider, because you are probably the most original and imaginative modder we've got. I don't know of anyone else who would think to provide us with collectible action figures and Azura's coffee shops. If you decide to quit for whatever reason, at least know the work you've done has been appreciated.

Yeah this is really quite sad . i love your mods (such as Placeable tombstones-which saddly i need to redownload cause i lost it-, backpacks and Dragonlance items)

today i tried to download the Amulet mod and the portable sign mod and found out it was blocked, then i checked all your other ones and they were blocked too and i thought something was wrong.


anyway for all your hard work you put into your mods. bye and good luck


Edit: i managed to find the Amulet and Sign mod on another site (my sig has one of he amulets on it)

Message to all

Since Jannix has quit I think I'll tell you all how important he is to this community.

You have all seen the kicky underwear mod makers and the modders that make flashy armour and never want to share it. Well Jannix makes lots of more useful things, things that people usually go not yell wow at but things that make other peoples mods really shine, things you miss if they are not but make a room look WOWish if they are added to a scene. Sometimes a mear pot or a chicken makes a dinner scene work, Jannix provides those things.

For example, he made the skeleton staff for my The Necromancer mod and really made the Necromancers feel special because of it. I searched for resources at the time to provide that and none existed, so he came through for me.

He made the Arenthia guards uniform to my exact requirements so the guards you see are the guards i wanted for that city. I could have given poor guards very expensive armour but it would not have looked right so jannix produced some armour that looked like a guard could afford it just as i asked.

He makes the little things modders like me need. Roast chickens may be a joke to you but for me, its something thats perfect for the kvatch invite guests to dinner quest and if i had the time, it would be in that mod for that purpose. I would even have added a little smoke to enhance the effect.

Jannix supplies those little things nobody else makes. He provides the paint you might say that I use to make my mods.

You may think hes just another modder, but he is irriplaceable because there are very few people making those useful modders resources. Those that exist usually make the fancier stuff but not the boring day to day stuff mod makers like me find so useful.

Mod makers like these provide the boring extremely useful stuff you see all over my work. I am actually in the process of making webpage to highlight these unsung heros on my website. Its not ready yet but the page exists. I always get credited for their work and i dont like it, credit should go to those who earned it and all of these did earn it.

Jannix
Razor
Siika
Xiamara
AlienSlof

All make the building blocks for mods like mine and I know youve enjoyed my mods.

Mods like Kvatch Aftermath constantly get attention and I constantly get lots of Kudos for my work. But the Kudos should go to people like those named above. The resource makers that allow me to make what i make within your life times.

So Jannix is vital to this community, but i bet most people under rated his value or didnt even know how many projects his work already touches because he does not wave his own flag. He is a little quiet modder that stays in the shadows i found.

Well Jan, i hope you dont mind me waving your flag for a bit, you deserve the credit for what youve done and i for one want the others to understand how valuable an asset you are around here.

All the best.

Giskard

Sorry to hear you've quit, Jannix. You're a talented individual, and made some great mods. I am one of many sad to see you go.

that was very sweet Giskard. *cheer*

Wow...I wish there was something I could have done to help you Jannix.

Modding is quite fun as I can tell you enjoy what you do in your mods. If it were comments @ TESNexus that brought you down, I wish you would have used the report button. I cannot do anything about what is said at the ESF though.

Do you mind if I continue with the Batman/girl and Supergirl projects?

Thanks and I wish the best for you.

Sincerely,
LHammonds

Jannix man you were my favorite modder...you helped me so much with the starwars mod...Does it have to do with that depression topic in the official forums? Man what ever you need just tell me and i'll try and help you...i got your back man as do many other people.

Well you can blame me, I had to set one of his files hidden due to it containing content from kotn even though it was modified mesh[es], the thread was shut down on the official forums for the same reason.

link to thread on the esf:
JQ - Templars, Knights & Hospitallers
http://www.bethsoft.com/bgsforums/index.ph...=863220&hl=

it pained me greatly to do it.

Buddah

Now I break my own rules, I liked these.....well thought out and quite appropriate to their titles and some of the best that I have seen to date in this genre.

This is an opinion that I will share.

Oh no, Jannix dont quit! I excitedly awaited Breakfast to be released but now hope is gone.

I agree completely; I've said the same before myself.

Buddah, it's certainly not your fault. You were only doing your job to protect Nexus. It's a shame, though, that something so small could cause such a big fiasco.

A couple of days ago I released the Templar armours, based on the KOTN cuirass mesh. The thread at the bethsoft forums was shut down by Princess Stomper for redistributing content.

Perhaps thats fair, perhaps its not, but in my view the content is not exactly the same. The templar armour for the male had the bottom half totally removed and replaced, and the pauldrons were removed and replaced with different plates made by me. The texture was also redone. The female version had the pauldrons removed and replaced with plates made by me. The helmet had the wings removed, and re-stitched to cover the holes. The whole neck area was removed and a helmet interior mesh was added. All the textures and icons were re-made.

In my opinion, its not the same mesh. The KOTN textures weren't included. By using my mod, you cannot recreate or play the KOTN armour without buying the official expansion.

All that aside, and whether you consider it stolen content, I never was contacted about it before my thread was closed and I was labeled as stealing content. Even if it was considered stolen, I'd have though I'd get enough respect to be contacted first about it and not summarily labeled a thief and having my reputation tarnished. At least that way I could have explained the differences.

To those who support my mods, I thank you. Its a shame to stop releasing stuff but apparently I'm a dirty thief.

Your no thief the only way someone could redistribute your mods is by building a time machine and downloading all your mods and redistributing them under their name

Well, the whole DLC and expansion pack rules are so convoluted that I have always refused to mod for them. I consider it a waste of time due to the ridiculous licensing.

Do not think of yourself as a thief or let others think of you that way either. Bethesda has a blanket rule about those DLCs so it does not matter if it is a single vertex or the entire mesh that was used.

Remember my quest for permission from the BBC to release a mod with the likeness of their Robot Man? Had I been able to talk with somebody in charge, things might have been different but they have an overriding blanket rule and all their employees that reply to emails use nothing but the "sorry, cannot do that" email.

I would just chalk it up as a learning experience to never mod the DLCs and move on. But if looking at Oblivion has a bad taint due to this mod, then it might be time to pick another game to mod. I'm sorry that I do not have any suggestions at the moment since I love sword and armor games and regarding the modding aspect and gameplay, this is about as good as it gets so far. I've heard people enjoy the CryTeck modding but it is in a genre that doesn't quite float my boat.

LHammonds

You're not a "dirty thief" (unless perhaps for Sony but then we're all "dirty thieves" according to their definition) and I don't think any one really thought that...at the very worse, it's a simple mistake made in good faith (if there was a mistake...how much modification is required...according to beth, it doesn't matter...but its a gray area - personally I see some flaws in their DLC licensing system...which I can't even access after installation btw...but I can't elaborate here and I'm not from the US anyway). In any event, if the only issue was to make the mod dependent on KOTN...why not just do it if it can make everybody happy? I have seen plenty of meshes from SI, the horse armor mod & others that were doing just that and they don't seem to have a problem with those on the TES forums.

I seriously hope you will reconsider...I and many others will miss your creations and your sense of humor (and for once we were guaranteed not to get anime stuff!).


Now that my vampire has seen the skINGRADS he can no longer be satisfied with mortal blood

I find this situation very odd.

The moderators have never had a problem with people releasing retextures of, and mods containing, the shivering isles meshes/textures.

And I'm certain that there are other mods out there that use the KOTN meshes but retexture them, but have a tiny little flag on them that says "requires KOTN"... and I've never seen any problems with them.

It seems to me there's simply a misunderstanding happening here. Very odd.

That is sad to hear but I understand your reasons. Best of luck to you.

And by converting SI meshes to fit Exnems or FF, they're actually doing worse than what you've claimed. Actually, all retextures fall into that same group, since it';s neither the usage, nor the actual amount of content that matters. The rules on this sort of thing have been so twisted and left to interpertation, and asking for clarification will only result in the powers that be deciding everything is against the rules. Sorry to see you go, you made some great stuff, but this is really just another example about how Bethsoft doesn't give a crap about the modding community that keeps their game selling, and the legal issues that will never get worked out as long as they insist on this sort of mentallity.

i am sorry to hear that.. jannix..
and i was looking forward to your crown mod:D

i hope you will read the messages pleople posted here..

I didn't actually know about this until I found a report waiting for me. I am truly sorry to see you go, JQ - many of your original and fun little mods are a mainstay of my game. I love hunting down those t-shirts! I for one, will miss your contributions to my game.

I also know from bitter personal experience that the actions of some people can sour a hobby that is supposed to bring enjoyment, so you have my full support. I know you've suffered flak before and there comes a time when it just reaches a point where it can no longer be simply brushed aside.

I hope you will drop by and read this and see that there are those of us who will miss you. I wish you the best in whatever you turn your imagination and talents to.

they must have thought of it as setting an example by closing a thread by someone of your stature over this. i don't think what you did, JQ, was stealing or distributing anything illegally, if they could only see the work that must have went into it for you to say that it isn't that same model from the expansion.. thanks for being with us in the first place and i wish you the best, man!

I finally found the post JQ was talking about. I think the main problem was this:

1. Jannix said the resources originally from KOTN and this mod was made to NOT require KOTN
2. This statement was made on the official forums and cannot be ignored there.

I do not think this was a "let's make an example out of him" scenario. I think this was more about:

1. Modding DLCs
2. Making release threads on the official forums
3. Not making the mod dependent upon having the DLC

As I've stated before, I avoid the issue completely by not modding for the DLCs but Bethesda "seems" to turn a blind eye to mods that contain the content but make an effort to "require" the DLC before it will work. But if you ask them directly, they will say not to do it (they cannot say anything else because of legalities).

So the only real "gray" area is the fact that meshes and textures are being created and released in mods (breaks the EULA) but Bethesda does not actively go after anyone. But they will shutdown any mod on their forums that does this AND makes it not require the DLC.

This is just my observation...I do not mod for DLCs and when asked, I recommend others do not either simply because I do not like the "gray" area.

EDIT: Forgot the "NOT" in the above sentence. hehehe.

LHammonds

Jannix & Nexus

Jannix, You know I do not mean you ill but i have been modding for a long time and I found the rules to be simple to understand once you get your head around it. Its a little like GPL content, anything made from GPL material remains under the GPL liciense. They cannot charge for it EVER no matter how many improvements somebody makes to a GPL product.

Same with copyrighted stuff, if you use copyrighted stuff at all, the original license applies in full to your own work on their copyrighted material. This includes the use of commands found in beth owned programming languages. EG you may write a script but you use their programming language to do it so its their property.

Even if you change it, providing the original models are copyrighted, your work must obey that copyright. Any edited versions of Beths work for example still belongs to BETH.

Modders gain special permission to edit content for a product they paid for because it promotes that product and ultimately benefits the company selling it. That license assumes your editing oblivion material for the oblivion game and not lord of the rings material for the oblivion game.

But the problem here is that the plugins are sold separately online and that means plugins must be treated as a separate game. Its like expansions for a game, they are considered to be a separate game even though they need the original.

Beth must take reasonable action to defend its rights or the law says it loses its rights. Closing threads could be considered reasonable action. As is using an installer that demands authenticiation to install a plugin.

So they did their part to protect their mod.

So the thing at fault here is the assumption that plugins are considered oblivion material for modding purposes. Most players and lore based websites already mix plugin content with oblivion content without stating the source. Check the wiki or imperial library. Ive seen vile lair lore content on the Imperial Library but its not marked as such.

Beth never told them not to do that, mixing the two as they have should have triggered a response but it did not happen so beths lack of action sent a message that what Jannix did is actually ok, same situation only its not a website its a mod.

But its not, its a separate game at the end of the day and we cannot get away from that fact, no matter how many breaches we highlight in the plugins copyright.

I personally favour asking Beth for some clarification on this. Since its of interest to Nexus and us modders.

A representative of Nexus would be an ideal choice to approach beth and ask, can we use plugin meshes, textures, sounds and lore material if the end user has to own the Oblivion game to use them, or must we make sure the end user also has to own the original plugin too.

Pointing out that websites do not make the distinction between plugin or oblivion content or Plugin and Morrowind Content and this situation has existed for many years now. In all cases plugins are treated as resources for the game they where made for.

Its only the fact people pay to download the plugins raises this issue now.

Giskard

Jannix, bottom line is: You are not a thief.

Every member here that knows you and uses your mods also knows this. Your reputation is not tarnished at all, as far as I'm concerned.

I am one of those people who digs in and reads Mod Descriptions before I download them. Like Giskard said, it impressed me to see you helped others with their mods.

You have made a lot of great additions to the game, Jannix. I use your "Crystal Staff" mod, for example. To me, it's not just a simple torch mod. I personally felt it was a stroke of genius to come up with an item that is permanently lit when you go underground. You made it even more realistic by having it extinguish whenever a character goes underwater.

Your mods filled in a lot of gaps in Oblivion. It surely improved my game a great deal.

I'll certainly voice my support to you, Jannix. I think it was really great that you shared your creations with us.

I agree, this is just one of those things that randomly strikes modders from time to time when mod maker rules get twisted due to how things are released. Somebody has to fall foul of it for the rest to find out which set of rules apply.

Unfortunately Jannix, this time its your turn.

Its as simple as that really.
Those suggesting anything different...

A) Clearly do not know you that well.
B) Are clearly not aware of the complicated situation modders are placed in at the best of times.

Giskard

Hmmm... I hardly ever comment on stuff in the Nexus forums, but this was just brought to my attention about 3 minutes after I spent a little while carefully placing JQ's beautifully re-done potion bottles all over the waterfront shack. They are so pretty, unique and cool to look at when displayed.

I sincerely hope, with a few days perspective, that you will re-think your stance on pulling your mods. I don't think anyone with the possible exception of some trolling losers, would ever think of you as a thief. If mods here or on BGSF were concerned about official content and use and whatnot, I know they would prefer to err on the side of caution - but that in no way reflects on their view of you as a modder or your many fun and useful mods.

Has anyone thought about the FACT that when Bethesda released Oblivion, the ONLY mods they expected to see (using the construction set) were .esp plugin files. There were no tools released for unpacking their BSA files or converting DDS textures, creating NIF models or KF animations.

So basically, any mod that has more than just a .esp plugin is in a kind of "gray" area of sorts because we are only able to do these sorts of things because of reverse engineering.

Obviously, Bethesda has not "called us out" and said to stop doing that (although one would wonder why not) but instead, they are kind of proud about what the modding community has done. If you are unsure, check their BLOG site. They have interviewed tons of modders...all of which have created much more than just a .esp plugin.

Giskard has already said it: "Somebody has to call foul of it for the rest to find out which set of rules apply"

I'm glad the NifTools team continued on and did what they did rather than shying away when it came to pushing the boundaries as to what is possible (and allowed)

LHammonds

LHammonds

You make a good point about Beths original intentions and the CS and ESP thing. I doubt their license actually allows reverse engineering anything because most games expressly forbid that, yet that is what many modders do to make their own mods work.

So we could have pushed out luck a little too far already and this may be the straw that breaks the camels back.

Just a thought.

Giskard

Thanks, Jannix for all the wonderful, unusual items I
now enjoy in my game. I will greatly miss the ones
that would have come in the future, not to mention
the ones I was savoring and had not yet downloaded.

This is just another sad void that has appeared in a
great game.

I hope you do well and enjoy all your new endeavors.

damn it, another gr8 modder gone =(

I luved your mods =(

This saddens me.. So, would it have technically been ok to release the crusader outfits if it required KOTN?

I don't think any camel is going to get their back broken (especially on a mountain...hehehe) so I do not think it will begin a floodgate of smacking modder's hands for including any kind of NIF and DDS files in mods (they have already patted too many people on the back for doing so). I think this was purely based on it being presented on the official forums that a mod was released with KOTN content (even if severely modified) and does not require KOTN (a relatively simple plugin trickery technique).

Regarding the plugins, they do not like seeing any of the following re-released without requiring dependency on the DLCs (Meshes, Textures or the Plugin...basically anything that came with the download / CDROM)

LHammonds

That's the idea, but in reality, it doesn't make much difference. Either way, the mesh is being distributed. An experienced CS user could simply make a new plugin. An amateur user with TES4Gecko could remove the dependency.

Personally, I disagree with the "official" stance concerning this, but what are you going to do?

I am sorry to hear about this. You are certainly NOT a thief. I and many others really enjoy and rely on your work in our own modding. So I do hope that you will come back after a rest.
I agree with Giskard on the ESF in general, I avoid as much as possible and only go if I absolutely have too for ORE site purposes. Life has become much more peaceful.

I have known Princess Stomper quite a while now and would not hesitate to describe her as a very fair and honest person. For those that mentioned the possibility of a personal attack, I know that this in absolutely no way was. Anyone who knows her, knows she is honest, upfront and direct, she will not insinuate something snidely. She has no problem telling you what she thinks. My point is.. don't read more into the locking of the thread then there is. She is not calling you a thief, she is following regulations and nothing more.

Now some other moderators there........politely put, can be very frustrating.

On a slightly side note, there are many incredible modders creating incredible resources that receive little accolade for their efforts, this was a recent topic on my own forum. I try and shout about it from my resource site MORE and created a Hall of Modders specifically for those unsung resource creators because I just feel, like Giskard said, we need to give them a little more vocal appreciation.

I hate to see you leave Jannix. Any chance we can see you modding for another game though? It's a shame you put all this talent to waste. I understand your reasons though, I'm sorry it went this way. I will enjoy your mods for a long time though, and I bet other will too!

Giskard, you and I don't agree very often at all, but for once I can do nothing else.

I agree that Jannix was one of those modders who actually brought more important stuff. I have quite a bit of his resources here and I must say they really add to a mod. It's a shame his mods will never see the light again.

I also agree with you that Bet'hs official forums are getting more and more worse by the day. I won't call any names, but recent additions to the moderating team are making it feel even more less free. Furthermore I'm quite tired of these guys enforcing messed up polices. Just the other day I get a message that my avatar was too big when it came to filesize. The reason... oh my if that guy stood in front of me I would have probably given him a good wake-up call. Most incorrect reason ever. But according to him I just had to deal with it, oh I'm fairly certain I will if he manages to pull it off to remove my avatar for that reason again

However that's just my personal ranting about Beth's colorfull (as in 16 different forms of Gray...) forums.

Jannix, I so totally understand why you did this. I wish you the best of luck in whatever you will do now. I truly hope though that this was all a misunderstanding, but I'm not talking about a misunderstanding from your side there. Let me be perfectly clear on that.

Trademark

Your one of the best freelance modders in our community, no doubt about it. Although 90% of the community will support you until the end, I know that is of little consequence to someone who has lost face in this way. We can all beg you to stay but what it really comes down to is, can you live with the shame of making such a mistake? If the answer is no then our community loses a great asset and if the answer is yes then you have to always look over your shoulder for the next person that will accuse you of repeating that mistake(on BGSF anyway). A tough choice that is certain and one no one else can help you make. In my opinion this incident pales in comparison to all of your contributions and will soon be forgotten but nobody's opinion can change the way you feel and if that feeling takes you away from here then so be it. I think that feeling will fade in time and I also think that you shouldn't feel so ashamed but again, no one can change the way you feel by a few kind words no matter how many people say them. I for one would love you to reconsider and hope that you do. All in all when it's all over, I'll look back at Oblivion modding and the people that made it great, I'll think of people just like you and the great things they did but incidents like this will be forgotten amidst the revelry.

If it is to be then I bid you a fond farewell and thank you for all you've given me in your labor of love and hope that you find this kind of love once more, whether it is here or elsewhere. Good luck and take care JQ, you will be missed by many.

Jannix-
Your character and talent are not questioned- I believe that the situtation was one where nothing else could have been done - it was the Official Forum, after all, and if there was a perceived permission being given, the whole EULA would be worthless. I am one of the many who throughly enjoyed the origionality and talent that you regularly displayed in your work. I would ask that you think about it a bit, and then chalk it up to one of Life's Unfairnesses. I will not be the only one to miss your talent and skill- for all the clever mods, and hopefully for those yet to come.

Ivy

Repost from the ESF thread ( which is now locked ):

Yeesh. A shame the issue of content redistribution had to come up like this. This is why I hate copyright problems and I'm sure is why there's very little work being done in the DLCs or SI since it's never been made entirely clear what's acceptable and what's not.

To put it simply, starting with X, using tools to hack it up and make Y, which eventually leads to Z is still a derived work of X under the law. Bethesda must then act accordingly in order to maintain the effectiveness of their license not their copyright. Their copyright is inviolate and would withstand court challenge easily. It's the license that could be jeopardized by not properly enforcing it.

That said, we need to know clearly what's permitted and what's not. Are mods which rebuild JUST a mesh allowed? Mods that rebuild JUST a texture? Mods that use an ESP that requires a parent file such as Knights.esp? In the case of texture replacer packs that also include the meshes, how does one set it so the original game/expansion is still required to make it work? I imagine all of this would be good information and should be stickied once provided. <-- This last part might fit under the "don't discuss moderator actions on the forum" rule that was quoted by summer. So I don't know if she/he saw it since I posted literally seconds before the thread got locked. But it *IS* an important clarification we all need.

Jannix Quinn, thank you for sharing your work with all of us. Thanks to you, my chars have a warm fur woodsman's hat, bandages, sign posts, and a fancy new backpack to store it all in. Anyway, it is indeed sad news to hear you have stopped, but that is your choice. Good luck to you, JQ.